Deeper Dive with Upper School English & Math Teacher Karen Sandoz

The Upper School is upping its game with R.E.A.L.®, a program that intentionally develops discussion-based skills that RCDS students will utilize for a lifetime. Karen Sandoz explains how the program works and why it aligns so well with RCDS’s Signature Academics that emphasize communication, critical thinking, and rigorous learning in preparation for high school and college.

What is R.E.A.L.® Discussion?

R.E.A.L.® Discussion is a program designed for the intentional teaching of the art of classroom discussion. It provides an explicit process, procedures, and routines to help students become better at discussion. The program also helps to address “technoference,” a term used to describe how digital devices interrupt real-life connections. Communicating through screens and on social media interferes with students’ ability to have face-to-face conversations, whether it’s in the classroom or at the dinner table, and we are working to counter that impact. RCDS faculty in all Upper School English classes, Grades 5-8, have been using the program since the beginning of the academic year.

RCDS emphasizes communication and public speaking skills from Nursery to Grade 8. What was the added benefit of adapting R.E.A.L.®?

It’s about upping our game. We want our students to be even stronger readers, writers, and communicators. The intentional development of specific skill sets is integral to that effort. The goal is to build an integrated Upper School English program that promotes discussion, fosters deep thinking, and strengthens students’ ability to analyze challenging material. We are preparing all our students to be successful in rigorous high school environments, in all content areas, where they will be expected to think and write about text at a very high level.

Because the RCDS English program teaches reading, writing, grammar, and vocabulary through novels, short stories, informational texts, poetry, and plays, students are engaged in authentic literary experiences. This lends itself to facilitating rich, inclusive classroom discussions. R.E.A.L.® is also rooted in the Socratic Method and discussion-based learning, which is a foundational part of teaching and learning at RCDS and beyond.

What are some of the skill sets that students develop or build upon through the program? 

The assumption often made is that children somehow know how to have an academic discussion. That’s just not the case. R.E.A.L. explicitly teaches a framework and routines for speaking and listening. There are pre-discussion strategies, such as setting personal goals and preparing for formal discussions in advance with provided discussion questions (DQs). DQs ask students to critically analyze what they are reading and extend their thinking beyond the text to make connections to the world around them. DQs instill the habits students need to prepare for a substantive classroom discussion. The questions are not, “Who is the main character?” but thematic, high-level, critical thinking questions. Students must cite specific pieces of evidence from the text(s) and prepare notes. They also take “real-time” notes on their peers’ comments and interpretations.

Listening skills are also explicitly taught. Students learn what listening looks like; they use verbal and non-verbal signals, such as a hand signal to say that they like or agree with a peer’s contribution. Students make eye contact with the speaker, their classmate, instead of always looking at the teacher for validation.

DQ Prep ties in nicely with the annotation of written material that RCDS students routinely do starting in fifth grade. Annotation is active reading because you’re interacting with the text as you make notes. You might annotate a moment in the story where the character has an “aha” moment or mark a passage that signifies something central to the theme or character development.

There’s a lot of concern today in education about the impact of students using ChatGPT and AI, but you can’t fake DQ Prep or an in-person discussion. It really puts accountability on students, and they come in ready to contribute. It’s authentic.

How else does the program impact classroom learning?

The program is really about motivation, validation, and growth in a community. I love that the message of R.E.A.L. is “Good things happen when we talk and REALLY listen to each other”. The post-discussion stage allows for reflection and the opportunity to apply what was discussed in their essay writing. The goal is that this is not just for the English classroom. These skills can be carried into other subject areas like social studies and science, where classroom conversations are also based on reading and analyzing complex texts. This is what students will do in high school and beyond. The teaching of the R.E.A.L. program is intentional; students should bring these skills with them to all their learning environments, and hopefully home to the dinner table, and into the future.  

What impacts have you seen since Upper School faculty began using the R.E.A.L. program?

It’s only been five months, and we’ve seen significant growth, academically, socially, and emotionally, in our students. At the beginning of the year, students took a survey on their comfort level talking in class and discussing material. It’s been interesting to see students who responded that they were not comfortable speaking up start to feel more comfortable because they’ve had time to prepare, and they know the routines and expectations of a discussion. It added to their toolbox. Shout-outs also help. A shout-out, part of the post-discussion stage, allows students to comment on what their peers said in a very tangible way. We do it with Post-it notes, and my co-teacher and I noticed that once a student received positive feedback, it gave them the comfort and courage to speak up more.

We’re also seeing better quality writing, which is a domino effect. Students are using critical thought. They are excerpting, listening to their peers’ perspectives and ideas, and then putting these ideas into their own writing. Written responses are definitely stronger. 

Why do you think the program has been so successful at RCDS?

When I joined the RCDS faculty, I was immediately impressed with the students’ comfort level and ability in public speaking. Students feel safe expressing themselves with their peers, and the strong sense of community made it very easy to do our first R.E.A.L. discussion. We weren’t sure what was going to happen, but the students flew with it. RCDS students like challenges. 

Our English faculty also does a great job choosing texts that are thought-provoking and complex. R.E.A.L. continues to build on the rigorous nature of the literature program here. 

Karen Sandoz has taught English and math at The Rumson Country Day School since 2023. Prior to RCDS, Ms. Sandoz taught for 26 years, and before that, worked for the Bank of New York on Wall Street. Coaching soccer and the inspiration of her high school economics teacher set her on the path of education. She holds a Bachelor of Science in International Studies from Drexel University and a Master of Arts in Teaching from Monmouth University. Ms. Sandoz also coaches the RCDS girls’ soccer team and is an advisor to the Student Council.